I noticed this pile of? That looks like reddish brown sand had appeared on my floor the other day. It was about the size of a quarter. I cleaned it up, but by the next morning a new pile was being formed in the same place! It’s been happening now for a few days. The white residue is a product of natural gas combustion. When the unit first lights, the glass is cool enough to allow moisture from the combustion process to condense on the glass. As the glass surface heats up, the moisture subsequently evaporates but leaves the residue behind.
If you plan to use a ventless fireplace to save money, make sure you consider the safety concerns.Some service providers say unvented fireplaces burn more efficiently than their vented gas-powered counterparts and cost less to install. Other providers and organizations contend ventless fireplaces are unsafe or otherwise undesirable.The National Association of Certified Home Inspectors warns that these fireplaces necessarily vent unburned combustion products — including carbon monoxide — directly into the living space. Although most vent-free manufacturers install an oxygen-detection sensor designed to automatically shut the fireplace down if oxygen levels in the home become too low, your family's health and safety are riding on that sensor working. While no deaths from vent-free fireplace incidents have been reported, NACHI says, some municipalities have restricted or outlawed vent-free fireplaces.
The District of Columbia bans the fireplaces only in bedrooms or bathrooms, but Virginia and Maryland don’t restrict them. California banned ventless fireplaces because of the risks, but no other states outlaw their use.“They put out tons of heat and they’re 100 percent efficient, but they use oxygen in the room and put out carbon monoxide, and they smell terrible,” says Bill Yeager, owner of in Fredericksburg, Virginia. “It’s like a car running in the house,” Yeager says. He says he had a ventless fireplace in his own home for five years and installs and services them, but he typically steers customers to other options. On the other hand, Steve Swerdlin, owner of in Olney, Maryland, endorses ventless fireplaces. He says vent-free fireplaces that are properly installed and serviced annually should function well. “There’s a lot of training in this industry now, and once it’s serviced by someone who knows what they’re doing, you shouldn’t have problems,” Swerdlin says, but adds that he doesn’t recommend ventless fireplaces for people with respiratory issues, asthma or severe allergies.Angela Tin, the American Lung Association’s vice president of environmental health, agrees.
“Generally, we don’t recommend combustion products for people with health problems, but for healthy people, if the carbon monoxide sensors are working properly, they would seem to be fine,” she says.Ventless Fireplace Maintenance Tips. Make sure logs are placed correctly, according to the instructions. Have your fireplace inspected annually. Make sure your fireplace sensor is free of dust and other particlesSwerdlin says annual service and proper fireplace maintenance eliminate most dangers. He charges between $175 and $225 for the service, depending on how much cleaning the fireplace requires.
Dust and other particles clog the sensor, which need to be cleaned once a year, he says. He adds that the logs need to be placed a certain way in the fireplace, which should come with a diagram. “If the logs aren’t in the right place, it can create black soot and the logs will produce carbon monoxide,” Swerdlin says.say vent-free fireplaces don’t affect a home’s resale value when compared to their vented counterparts, but add that they’ll suggest a vented fireplace if a homeowner needs to choose between the two options.“Homeowners usually just see a fireplace, and don’t think much about how it operates,” says, a Realtor in Fairfax, Virginia. Either option provides a return on investment, says, a Realtor with RE/MAX Advantage in Columbia, Maryland. “Having a fireplace at all adds value.”If your fireplace requires a gas-line connection, the installer must be inVirginiaMarylandandD.C Some contractors will install the gas lines, while others won’t, so homeowners should ask installers what they’re able to do and what their home will need for a vent-free installation. The National Fireplace Institute provides certifications for installers, including a gas specialist distinction for vent-free installers, but the certification isn’t required by law.
Yeager charges around $900 for a ventless gas fireplace installation that includes gas logs, which typically cost between $200 and $300 if purchased separately. Gas logs for vented fireplaces cost $1,200 to $1,400, he says.Swerdlin, who’s only licensed to install vent-free fireplaces in Maryland, says the fireplaces have improved over time and remain a convenient option. “There are no liners you have to deal with and no chimney issues,” he says.
“Low cost and heat are the top reasons people want them.”Do you have a ventless fireplace, or have you considered installing one? Tell us about it in the comments below.Editor's note: This is an updated version of a story originally posted on Aug. We are considering a vent free fireplace however after reading various articles about safety issues we are now hesitant. The installer advised us to crack a window when the fireplace is in use.does that lessen the risk?
He also suggested not using beyond 3 hours at a time.Neither of us have any respiratory issues, no pets and no longer have children in the house. Are plan is to place it in our addition and really just use it perhaps an hour or two each night, if that during winter months.
Does limited use lessen the exposure? And that our addition has three outside walls - does that help?. We live in Michigan. We have two of them and have had for the last 4 1/2 years and I love them. They have saved our heating bill because they heat the main floor and not the basement, which our furnace at 220 has to. My husband, me and our 5 year old live in the house. We have 2053 sq foot on the main floor and have never had a problem.
We have two carbon monoxide detectors. We have 1 big fireplace in the living room and one in the bedroom, but our bedroom is 700 sq ft so big enough to accommodate it. They have shut offs for safety features. We love ours. We have a propane vent free insert in our fireplace that was there when we bought the home.
We are told it is the bottom line and it is only for ambiance, as there is no heat that comes from it. We are considering a vent free insert that we CAN get heat from, however, I am not sure I trust that it is safe. I have asthma and allergies as well. It would be nice to make this fireplace functioning and throw out some heat. What do you recommend? And who do you recommend in New Hampshire? Thanks Doreen.
After almost 3 months of my DIY install, my ventless fireplace has been awesome and everything that I originally expected! The heat output is fantastic (25,000-36,00 BTU's variable based on the control) and has been very fuel efficient compared to the former Heat N Glo vented unit which was VERY inefficient and did not throw much heat.
A few observations:I am very handy and the install was relatively easy.I read all the instructions carefully before the install and was VERY meticulous about the gas line hookup! I also followed the instructions carefully about the log placement.
The gas logs did smell for about the fist full week of use and was noted in the instructions but after that timeframe, the smell has totaled dissipated.NO SMELL now! As for CO emissions, not a single alert by my CO detectors. O2 depletion sensor on the fireplace has not interrupted the flame at all.
Yes, the fireplace produces some moisture since the Humidity gauge goes up slightly when the fireplace is on, but as noted in my earlier post, it is welcome in the winter in NE. The fireplace has been on 2 hours today and the current reading is 36% humidity.non issue! My 16 year old cat sits in front of the fireplace and shows zero health issues.
Bottom line is that the vented fireplace is the way to go for heat with minor detrimental benefits. I still wonder why the 'professionals' so often push the vented fireplaces in very cold environments when people are looking for heat benefits since vented fireplaces provide marginal heat, look better, but are VERY inefficient.there is no get around having a hole in the fireplace to vent the gas is throwing dollars out the flue. My home has never been warmer in the winter AND has cut my heating bill in half. I the do it yourselfer by all means, almost to the eccentric aspect so I have been told. I learned on our first set of logs from Lowes. To see if we would like them before opting for a more expensive set with remote options.
The new smell about drove us into think we made a big mistake then a friend of ours that works for a propane delivery company said take them outside like under a carport hook them up to a 20 pound LP cylinder and run a full tan thru it wide open. Didi that took them back in absolutely no smell. When we stepped up to the more expensive set we did the same thing. One thing we learned if your going to do any painting the VFO's that the paint gives off will make the logs seem like they are smelling but it's the Hydrocarbons burning off so do and staining or painting in the warn season. I am a hvac guy and the only difference between vented and ventless is one provides heat to your home and the other does not or very little. Vented gas fireplaces is the fools gold of heating appliances. When buying a Vented log set you are paying primarily for aesthetics meaning they look nice and give a little more realistic appearance of a true Wood fire.
The drawback is they cost much more and heat far far less. Ventless is the way to go but there are some things to consider with the first being the quality of the set you purchase. The people above who complained about odors were in fact not produced by the flame but either by a very low quality log set or improperly placed logs. Low quality cheap sets have chemicals on them that when heated that smell horrible. They are often installed by the home owner who also places the logs wrong. The logs in a ventless set should never be in the direct flame. Combine low quality appliance with a diy home owner and you get a poorly performing ventless log set.
Here are some suggestions for prospective buyers. If the log set you purchase is less than $300 then your typically buying low quality fire logs. There are exceptions but not many so plan on spending 350 and up to insure quality. Check online reviews of your product as this will give you the best information on what to expect out of a particular log set. Next have them professionally installed. Installation is priority one and the diy artist seldom gets it right. Do these things and your ventless experience is almost guaranteed to be way more positive than vented.
Boy I never clean except once a year befor I turn it on in the winter. I have had the same one for 21 years.
I have never had a problem of any kind at all. Has no smell & it heats my entire 6 bedroom 2 story house build in 1904. Obviously it is not an airtight home. I am 63 and have a little high blood pressure but that is it.
My dog who just passed away loved to lay next to the fire. She was 17 when she passed. I love my ventless fireplace but now I am wondering if I should have it serviced since I never have. I've had TWO ventless fireplaces that burn continuously in the winter for the last 20 years and have NEVER smelled ANYTHING except maybe for the first few hours of use 20 years ago but not sure about that since it was soooooo long ago that they were installed by me.All the complaints about smell and CO boggles my mind and not sure about the reason why some people make that claim. I CAN'T SMELL ANYTHING and friends and family that come over cannot smell anything either.
They just feel warm and cozy!. What follows needs interpretation by an expert, which I am not.
We installed a ventless propane fireplace some years ago. Shortly after that I got into the marine aquarium hobby with a 120 gallon tank in the same room as the fireplace. The aquarium was computer monitored and controlled by various sensors and metering pumps. When Fall came around and we started using the fireplace, within a couple of hours the computer would alarm to a low ph condition in the aquarium.
Looking at the ph graph would show that the ph level began dropping within minutes of starting the fireplace, and continued dropping until the alarm set point was reached. It was easy to correlate because when the fireplace was turned off, the ph would slowly recover to normal level. We quit using the fireplace and haven't used it since, even though I am now out of the aquarium hobby. I found that oxygen levels directly affect water ph, maybe not enough to affect humans. That is where an expert needs to chime in. I majored in inorganic chemistry and there is no reason for the ph go significantly down (or up) just because you have an unvented natural gas open flame nearby. Products of such combustion are H2O and CO2.
Note that I typed CO2 and not CO as there is a big difference. CO, known as carbon monoxide is deadly and not an exhaust component from burning natural gas. CO2 is carbon dioxide and naturally occuring in the earth's atmosphere and a by-product of ALL oxidation (burning, breathing, etc.) I suppose a severe mal-function could possibly cause the burner to not work correctly and start putting out CO but if you're so worried about this very unlikely event then get a CO detector. I have no answer for pH going down.
Just seems not possible. My house is new construction. Has gas ventless fire place.It is electric start. There is a turn key in the wall and I turn the key to turn the gas supply on and off.
So I push a button to start pilot and there is another button with pilot, on and off.I have been nervous to leave the gas supply turned in the on with the key when I am not using the fireplace and always turn the key all 20 or so rotations until it is turned off between uses.Is it safe to leave the gas turned on all the time, if I have the electric start button in the 'off' position?Thanks. I have owned a vented Fireplace for over 10+ years now and have been totally disappointed with its efficiency. You don't have to be Einstein to figure that with a sealed glass front and a vent out the back of the fireplace to the outside, the efficiency is poor, being kind.at best 60/70's furnace efficiency. I added a blower to my vented fireplace which at least made it somewhat useful when before without the blower, these fireplaces are VERY inefficient.I am replacing my 1997 vented fireplace next weekend myself with a 99.99% efficient vent free fireplace that I purchased and can't wait for this winter in NE.
I know a number of people with vent free fireplaces (a few of them in South Carolina BTW) and based on my first hand performance of the vent free fireplaces, I made the decision to switch. I have never detected any unusual smell from those houses that have vent free fireplaces but did notice the tremendous heat output that these fireplaces emit.
I find it curious that the 'expert' opinions about homes in the coldest climates always seem to push the vented fireplaces which are very inefficient and would so benefit from the cost savings and heat output of much more efficient vent free fireplaces.Hmmmm.As for the safety scare so often purported by the experts, again, there are ZERO deaths associated with the vent free units.ZERO.and there is no way these fireplaces would be approved for indoor use if they were as dangerous as some suggest.NO WAY. Let stop the nonsense, shall we???As for moisture, that is a blessing in disguise for homes in the northern part of the country during the winter months. My house get so dry in the coldest months that my skin can crack.Moisture? Bring it on.these units are humidifiers which is a great BENEFIT. I am a hvac proffesional for 22 years and have installed and owned a nonvented fireplaces for over 12 years. I regularly clean my fireplace and own a carbon monoxide detector.
Our detector has never went above 22, and we have never smelled anything from our fireplace. I am concerned with the peoples statements on here that say they have an odor,etc. The installation must be a factor. I recommend cleaning them every month in winter season, ( literally takes 15 minutes), own and use a carbon monoxide detector, and you should be fine. We love ours and on a side note I have asthma and my daughter has a lung disease, both of us have never had issues since we installed the fireplace. The reason they are so efficient is how they operate, no different than you gas stove. Hopefully this helps with a decision on purchase, and for the most part the only complaint i see valid would be moisture, and if you have that problem your house is too air tight, and thats a different issue alltogether that needs addressed.
Unless there are additives in the gas coming into the house, the odor that I've experienced is simply the dust and debris that enters the fireplace and settles on the logs and unit over the course of non-use. A lack of cleaning the fireplace regularly, and in particular before first use, is probably one major source of smell. I know when I got my current home, first non-vented fireplaces, we turned them on shortly after moving into the home. The house was new and we did not have, or think that it was needed to have, the fireplaces cleaned. The house smelled pretty nasty.
Now I am sensitive to odor, but my wife noticed it as well. We basically stopped using them because it was not worth the smell that spread through the house.
We also were not convinced that cleaning the fireplace every time we wanted to run it was warranted either. We live in the south, so frequency and usable months are somewhat limited. In our previous house, similar climate but a little colder, we ran the vented fireplace a lot. It was really convenient. Simply open the vent and turn it on. I agree that it was not efficient, but it was convenient and we enjoyed being in front of it; as did the cats.So. The smell of non-vented fireplaces is real.
It's probably NOT the combustion of the gas itself. The questions are: how quickly does your house get dirty, how often are you willing to 'properly' clean the fireplace to have a fire, how often do you want to run it, and how important is the efficiency of running the it for a few hours?One side note about vented fireplaces, the flu is not completely sealed.
In our last home, we had a form of wasp nest in the top for flu's outlet. They would squeeze past the fully closed flu and get into the house; only in the fall for a few weeks before hibernation.
We never were stung or affected, but it was annoying to see 10 or so relatively large insects buzzing around your ceiling. Killing those only lead to more within a short time. The moral is a flu vent is just another potential problem for maintenance and other problems. There is no win win.
It's just with which issues are you willing and capable of dealing.Keep warn!. My wife and I are considering a fireplace for our basement. Love the idea of ventless for the ease of installation and of course cost difference due to added vent height extensions above ground.
Our concern is when we went to the fireplace store there were several of these burning on a cold cold Cleveland Winter and we both could taste and feel the effects of them. We have 7 foot ceilings in the basement and are a little freaked out by the experience we had. Is it just because there were so many burning at the same time that we experienced this and do you think in a good sized room with low ceilings we will have issues?. I can only speak about my own fireplace situation. I am on this site to find out how to get rid of the horrible smell/odor that comes from the fireplace when it is in use. It is not vented and the smell is overwhelming in my large family room and travels throughout the house. I only use it when necessary to take the chill out of the air and wanted to have more use of it but because of the odor it causes headaches and just makes you want to shut it off.
I would choose to go with a vented fireplace and may have one installed as this isn't working out. Kyle, Could you be anymore misinformed?? Every thing you said is a lie. There are NO vented gas fireplaces (with 2 exceptions. Neither of which you mentioned) that are efficient.
In fact, the DOE has banned any reference to heating and efficiency in all advertising of Vented (Direct Vent) gas fireplaces. As the the ratings they might quote were not independently tested and certified. The only heat that is produced is from the glass front.
Which in itself is dangerous, if there are small children in the home. The glass can reach temperatures up to 149 degrees. Documented cases of small children receiving serious burns are numerous.
Not the case with Ventfree. Let me stat by saying I am not an expert, nor do I own either vented or non-vented fireplaces, but have been heavily researching them as I prepare to make a buying decision.
I have read many articles and comments like yours, and the hardest thing is to find an unbiased, balanced view. Your comment is no exception.Vented fireplaces have their advantages, but efficiency is not one of them. At around 80% best case, these appliances are akin to gas furnaces from the 60s, 70s and 80s. Vent free appliances are 99.9% efficient, and as a result throw more heat. Other downsides to vented units are cost (2x to 3x the cost of a vent free, based on numerous estimates I have received), appearance (what good does a realistic flame do when you are viewing it through a glass window?), and safety (some units allow the glass to be exposed, which presents a serious burn danger, especially if you have children in the house).
You also have to be careful when placing them in an outside chase; cold air can infiltrate the unit, causing condensation and even frost in and on the unitIt seems to me the CO is a non-issue (the 'expert' comment in the parent article comparing it to running a car inside your house is comical); if these things are so dangerous, why are gas stoves sold, and in fact preferred, by most home buyers? All the criticisms I have read are strictly anecdotal and subjective. The only reliable, objective statistic (U.S. Consumer product Safety Commission) I have read is on the number of known fatalities from vent free appliances- zero.The only issue I am considering is moisture. I can see where in certain parts of the US (typically warm, humid areas like the Southeastern US), this might be an issue. We live in upstate NY where nearly every new home built that uses forced air has an inline humidifier to ADD moisture to otherwise very dry winter air. It also depends on room size; we have a large, open floor plan that provides about 5x the minimum cubic volume required.So when I read blanket statements like yours, it undermines your credibility.
It seems to me there are many factors, and perhaps vented fireplaces ar ethe right choice.sometimes. But disseminating misinformation such as vented gas fireplaces being efficient, and refusing to acknowledge the drawbacks of vented appliances, does a service to no one.